D'Arcy from Winnipeg
Musings of a Canadian BizTalk and SOA Developer

ASP.NET MVC Framework - Not a Step Backward, But a Step Back on Track

Sunday, December 16, 2007 3:03 AM

When I first heard about the MVC framework, I was intrigued by one aspect that didn't seem to make sense: that the layouts of pages were not done with a designer, and that outputting the dynamic aspects of the page were done by pushing markup to the presentation from the controller.

Blasphemy! We've been developing in ASP.NET for the last 7 years or so WITH the designer, which was a huge feature to add to web development (and still is)! Now we're given a framework that removes the need for a designer? Now we have a framework that won't help me bolster productivity by removing my need to understand the underlying markup and abstract that away into a set of windows-like control metaphors? How will I do web development on this framework?!

That's been the response of many when they realize the seemingly ugly truth that lurks beyond the promises of better testing, better integration with 3rd party open source tools, and the removal of the postback mechanism.

But the response is wrong. The response is similar to an addict, when you tell them that their life will be better without their targeted addiction substance. They recoil, they rage, and they can't see the message for what it is.

I'm going to make a pretty strong statement here, and I'm not excluding myself from this statement in the least: ASP.NET developers are not web developers...they're ASP.NET developers. They're dependant on the tools provided in Visual Studio, with the myriad of controls and data sources that can be dragged and dropped at will. They're comfortable using skin files for decorating their page elements and in click-dragging their tables to create a layout.

But take away their tools...take away their controls...take away their skin files...and they crumble. Why?

Because we've lost site of the basics. We've lost site of what the web was and is still built on: HTML, Javascript, CSS, and the HTTP Protocol. Those are the four pillars of the web, and a web developer needs to grasp an understanding of those things first before tackling the abstraction benefits that ASP.NET provides.

How many of us understand why we get the little red squiggleys in our source view when we capitalize our tag attribute names, or don't wrap the attribute values in double quotes, or have even stopped to really wonder what the DOCTYPE tag specifies? We don't, because the current state of browsers accepts loose HTML and we've grown accustomed to ASP.NET abstracting so much away that we've become lazy in understanding how our chosen technology actually works.

So don't try and figure out what the MVC team was thinking when they released something seemingly backwards...ask yourself why it bothers you so much that you'd actually need to understand the markup that's being output by your application. And then decide if you're a web developer, or just an ASP.NET developer.

D


Feedback

# re: ASP.NET MVC Framework - Not a Step Backward, But a Step Back on Track

Holy CRAP~! NICE post. As you well know, I *totally* agree. Now that you have made a stand it's up to you and I to go on the round as travelling salesmen and educate the entirety of Canada as to the rich glories of the MVC! 12/16/2007 3:51 PM | Justice~!

# re: ASP.NET MVC Framework - Not a Step Backward, But a Step Back on Track

I agree with you. I am very interested in this development. I've become "comfortable" with the ASP.NET web forms model, but never felt "good" about it.

I've always felt there has been a lack of a TRUE web development community around Microsoft tools.

But, perhaps with the introduction of http://mvccontrib.org this can be the beginning of a different era.

I started with PERL / CGI, and CGI.PM. There are still tons of great libraries on CPAN. People in that community have long since figured out test harnesses and all of that stuff that we hear about finally in the .NET / MS world. I welcome it. 12/19/2007 12:16 PM | Josh Gough

# re: ASP.NET MVC Framework - Not a Step Backward, But a Step Back on Track

I've had this same nagging feeling since starting to use asp.net. Microsoft wanted to convert windows developers to the web and produced a product and set of tehnologies that removed the need for them to get their hands dirty with all that nasty web stuff. "Ooo, you don't want to get your hands dirty with html and javascript. Let us handle that for you". Well, web development does involve learning multiple interwoven technologies, and if anyone isn't happy with that, then they should go back to windows development.
Nice article, and I like the title... it really is back on track.

Greg Woods

5/25/2008 2:26 AM | Greg Woods

Post a comment





 

Please add 7 and 5 and type the answer here: